In this Tough Things First podcast, Ray Zinn explores the often maligned idea that, when it comes to leadership, kindness and positive reinforcement are more effective at persuasion and achieving desired results than an iron fist.
Rob Artigo: You have been an example of servant leadership leading with grace, not power. That’s part of your philosophy. In your book, The Essential Leader, you talk about why that’s an important attribute for a good leader, for the essential leader. The question I have for you is have you noticed if modern leaders rely on authority, control, or incentives to drive performance instead of what you would consider a singular fundamental leadership example, leading with grace?
Ray Zinn: I think because of the lack of understanding of servant leadership, most of our leaders, especially in the political environment, lead with power and authority. They can’t seem to lead with love and respect, which I think are the more important, which is grace. Grace is charity, benevolence, virtuous, kindliness. Those are the characteristics of a servant leader, someone who doesn’t lead with power but rather leads with love.
Ray Zinn Cont: I liken this again to that shepherd and a sheep idea. A shepherd doesn’t get behind the flock and drive them with the staff, he’s in front. The sheep follow the leader because he is respected and loved. He’s protective. So a good servant leader is a protector. He protects his flock and he shows love and respect for them and leads with charity and benevolence. The reason we have so much divisiveness in this country is because our leaders are leading with power and authority, saying how great I am, how wonderful I am, how spectacular I’ve been doing, and it’s all about me, me, me, me rather than about you, you, you, you, you.
And at Micrel, the company that I founded in 1978 and sold in 2015, I led it for 37 years, we had very low turnover. In our company, we did a study. We would try to determine why people leave. In other words, we do an interview with them, HR, Human Resources does an interview with each employee that leaves and ask them why they’re leaving the company. We found that 75% of all employees that are leaving the company leave because they didn’t like their supervisor. The supervisor led with power and authority rather than with love and respect. You like to be around people, your friends, look at your friends you have, who love you, who respect you, who compliment you, and they lead with a very kindly and benevolent attitude.
In Micrel, we had the lowest turnover in the industry. In fact, we had half the turnover of our competitors, and the reason is because we worked with our management, our leaders, and teaching them to be more Christ-like, more loving, more benevolent, more willing to be a leader and not a pusher as you would, or a driver.
So the whole concept of servant leadership is that you don’t put yourself out there as the big dog, the big chief. You’re more submissive, meaning you’re willing to be one of them rather than over them. So I don’t call it being under, I don’t mean that, but I mean do you want to be with them? I was helping somebody, somebody was doing something for me on a ladder and the ladder was up 14 feet. As he went up the ladder, I stood behind it and held onto it, and when he came back down, he says, “Well, thank you. I’m impressed the fact that you held onto the ladder.” And I said, “Well, I’m supporting you, I’m protecting you.” And he really appreciated that because normally when he climbs the ladder, no one’s there to help or to support.
So a good leader is there to hang onto the ladder, to be the protector, to look out for them, and they feel it and they recognize that that’s what your goal and your intent is. Those kind of leaders are the ones that are going to be the most loved. Again, we are not trying to make our employees submissive. We don’t want them to feel put upon. We want them to feel that they’re part of the team and that you’re not standing over them. Also, when I ran Micrel, I made sure that my salary wasn’t any greater than 10% higher than the lowest paid employee. That again, was to show that I’m there as a supporter and a leader, not a taker and a leader.
Rob Artigo: And I remember in your book, The Essential Leader, you made up a fake.com that was a startup in this story, which is funny, it’s a play on an old fable, but the CEO takes the advice of someone that says that in order to get more money and seed money and whatnot, you need to show that you’re in charge. So you need to be on the floor above everyone else. And he had an office that was basically the entire top floor and a big desk near a window. That was it. There was nobody else up there, so he was separated. You’re a walk around and talking to people kind of leader.
In Silicon Valley’s high pressure environment, many leaders default to that sort of fear-based tactics. One last thought on that, Ray, what do you think before we close out?
Ray Zinn: I think again, we need to look at our political leaders and to get an example of how not to be, rather than how to be. This concept of me, me, I’m the greatest, the Muhammad Ali kind of thing just doesn’t fly with employees. They like to see that the leader is a supporter, like I mentioned about holding onto that ladder while that individual that was working for me climbed up that ladder to fix something that was up pretty high. So again, be a supporter, not a driver, not a pusher, but a leader. Get out there in front and show your employees that you’re here to protect them, to support them, to give them guidance and direction, not as a driver or a dictator, but as a loving, benevolent leader.
Rob Artigo: For our listeners, Ray, I hope whatever platform they’re listening to this podcast on right now, they will click on whatever rating system they have and follow the podcast, rate it and help us out at Tough Things first. They can join the conversation at toughthingsfirst.com. There’s lots of ways to continue their education on the website. Questions and comments are welcome there. Follow Ray at X, Facebook and LinkedIn, and of course, pick up Ray’s books, the Tough Things First, and also the Zen of Zen series one, two, and three. Coming soon will be the … What is it called? Zen of Zen Daily … I forget. Zen of Zen Daily. You can get that at Bookbaby.com right now if you want it in print. But we will do a soft start in March and then we will have that for sale for everybody on digital as well as print. The Essential Leader, 10 skills and attributes and fundamentals that make up the essential leader on sale now. Thanks, Ray.
Ray Zinn: Thanks Rob. Have a great day.
